tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post1274626105988057557..comments2023-10-01T14:37:09.159+01:00Comments on Maysaloon - ميسلون: 1492Maysaloonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06826378383173206624noreply@blogger.comBlogger71125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-35082389721633009892009-12-13T02:48:02.304+00:002009-12-13T02:48:02.304+00:00Actually the Ashkenazis might have been Khazars. M...Actually the Ashkenazis might have been Khazars. Most likely there was a small mongoloid/central asian population that turkicized the non-turkish masses as has happened in anatolia. Northern Caucasians are not Eastern Europeans/Slavs. They are proven to have J1,J2 blood. E1b1b has not been tested in the Northern Caucasus. Haplogroup G is also believed to have originated from the Caucasus. Ashkenazis are proven to have g1, g2a1 and G2a3b1. All of these haplogroups are link to Central Asia and the caucasus. G2c is a mystery, however it has not been more comprehensively investigated in the caucasus region.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-18583683536884930092008-03-02T12:17:00.000+00:002008-03-02T12:17:00.000+00:00http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/migrant-row-flare...http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/migrant-row-flares-before-spanish-election/2008/03/01/1204227050198.html<BR/><BR/>hard core.. cranky cycles of history..Lirunhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16165940866092660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-20251035247977089912008-02-15T15:37:00.000+00:002008-02-15T15:37:00.000+00:00you know amreyou are very lucky that you have us h...you know amre<BR/><BR/>you are very lucky that you have us here ... somebody to hate to keep you from messing with each other ... without us, i dont even dare to think of what you would have been doing to each other hereNobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-60407286799127407492008-02-15T12:37:00.000+00:002008-02-15T12:37:00.000+00:00According to mythology, Pennisula ASrabs are the d...According to mythology, Pennisula ASrabs are the descendant of Ismael the Hal Egyptian:) Prophet Muhammed talked about the blood line he has with Egyptians.<BR/><BR/>Now back to histyory, The kingdoms of norh western Arabia like Adomites were so much influenced by Egyptian tongue and writings. The sinai Arab kingoms..etc. Egyptian ancient history is full of stories about Egyptians banished to the Arabian deserts:)<BR/><BR/>10000 common words exist between modern standard Arabic and hieroglyohic.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Elamites were semites dude:)))))<BR/><BR/><BR/>The savage Indo- Iranian groups invaded the Iranian plateau roughly about 2000 B.C. western Iran is historically part of the Arab Iraq.<BR/><BR/>Time after time I tell you that Achaemenids had no alphabet and were illiterate. Aramiac became the standard language of the Empire because they had no other literary language. No point argueing on this, Roman:)<BR/><BR/> Parthians, Sassanids and the various peoples whió lived in what is called Iran, mereley mimiced the semitic Babylonian heritage and transfered to the pennisula Arabs, both the ancestors and descendants of Iraqis:)))<BR/><BR/>The entire history of ancient Iraq is made up of numerous semitic settlements from The Arabian pennisula in addition to Ammorites from Jordan- the ancestors of northern or Adnani Arabs.<BR/><BR/><BR/>About Kurds - those enjoyed a cultral specifity in Iraq never witnessed in the medieval retarded Iran or the ultra-nationalist Turkey. Saddam Built them the solemeniya university where teaching was excluisively in Kurdish. Kurdish language was imposed as a second language in all Iraqi school and there was never a Kurdish village denied schooling and health care.<BR/><BR/>In 1988 some terrorist Kurdish traitors infiltrated Iranian troops inside Iraq while Arabs were going through heroic battles against the baraberous fanatic extremist khomeinist Iranian hords in the south. Iraq wa facing an existentialistic threat. All possible means had to be used.<BR/><BR/>Besides, If some Kurdish factions opt to cooperate with Mossad, they have to pay for it. Fair is fair. I think we all know thelink between some Kurdish factions and Mossad which date as far backas the early sixties.<BR/><BR/><BR/>About Iraq there is no killing there. It is the evil malicious Iran which had pushed IRANIAN, AS DISTINCT FROM SHIITE, ELEMNTS AT THE INCEPTION OF THE INVASION TO WREAK BLOOD AND DSTRUCTION IN IRAQ. They can't heal from their shatering defeat in 1988 by Iraq and Egypt. That's why their hatred of Arab nationalism and grudge on Arabs- their tutors and educators have got no limits.G.Garhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573287809747571814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-1540629726500331462008-02-14T22:24:00.000+00:002008-02-14T22:24:00.000+00:00Correction: The Jews could *not* become part of th...Correction: The Jews could *not* become part of the government or army under Muslim rule.Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-86140856550622030522008-02-14T22:22:00.000+00:002008-02-14T22:22:00.000+00:00Pennisula Arabs were according to both mythology a...<I>Pennisula Arabs were according to both mythology and history a mix of Bbaylonians, Aramaics, Yemenese and Egyptians. They were not alliens super-imposed on the Arab world.<BR/><BR/>Here you are presuming a static history of isolated elemnts. Ypou totally overlook the way cultures evolve and interact in dialectical proceses to forge new cultural identies.<BR/></I><BR/><BR/>Firstly, Egyptians never entered that particular equation. Secondly, I do not overlook cultural interaction and evolution - I simply implore you to realize that the people of that era were not mere proto-Arabs waiting to become the Arab nationalists of today, and that the only people who defined themselves (and were seen by others ) as Arabs were the nomads of the Penisula, while their "origin nations" existed and thrived.<BR/><BR/>The expansion of the Arabs, and thus the Arab identity, came much later. Mere ethno-linguistic affiliation does not define a single nation - the Arabs were one group of many in the region that had similar ethnic and linguistic characteristics.<BR/><BR/><I>Don't forget that under the Arabic rule Jews expressd freedoms and tolerance never ever witnessed, maybe untill post world war two Europe.</I><BR/><BR/>False. The rights enjoyed by Jews even in Al-Andalus were those of second-class citizens. They could become part of the government or army, had to pay special taxes, and were gently yet quite clearly separated from the population majority. The Jews enjoyed similar status in the Frankish lands under Charlemagne, and in Prussia under King Ferdinand II, as well as many Caribbean colonies.<BR/><BR/>Al-Andalus, don't forget, ended with the new Muslim power (Almuhads) massacring, expelling, and forcibly converting the Jews.<BR/><BR/>The main advantage of Muslim lands to European Christian ones was that overall, from the Jewish perspective, there was a much lesser chance of being massacred, but this is not the same as universal rights.<BR/><BR/><I>Regarding Achaemenids, it remains a fact that they were illiterate with no aplhabet. They adopted the semitc babylonian ways.<BR/><BR/>they dint have an original civilisation nor a considerable impact to human civilisation.<BR/></I><BR/><BR/>Then what was the Elamite language, please? The language had a written form for several milleniums before the rise of the empire. At the decline of the Elamite tongue, Old Persian was already the dominant language.<BR/><BR/>You mistake deciding using a common language to the empire as an official Imperial language - thus making communication over an incredibly vast territory simpler - with not having a previous language at all.<BR/><BR/>As for the impact of the empire on humanity, are you kidding me here? The cultural advances in art and architecture aside, the first Persian empire represented the first global superpower - a nation ruling most of the known (to us) world, an empire built on the foundations of tolerance and mutual acceptance - Cyrus the Great, in the form of the Cyrus Cylinder, formed was what in essence the first bill of rights.<BR/><BR/>With the Silk Road, as well as other large projects to build and connect the various parts of the empire, the Persians connected the Far East not only to the Middle East, but to Europe as well.<BR/><BR/>Compared to the imperial Persian policy, just about any power that followed formed its dominion on power, supremacy, and the eradication of conquered cultures and religions rather than actual advancement of mankind.<BR/><BR/>Fast forward to the Sassanian Empire - that not only had an incredible impact on those who followed it (such as the Muslim empires), but also on the Roman Empire and beyond.<BR/><BR/>And I wouldn't discount the Partians out of hand - we know little of them save through the accounts of foreign nations about them, but even that displays a nation that wasn't at all inferior.<BR/><BR/>Amre... to revise history to such an extent that one of the greatest imperial powers known to Man, and truly one of the greatest nations of its era and whose echoes remained long after the empire was gone, becomes little more than a bunch of savages who got lucky in a couple of battles...<BR/><BR/><I>people are supposed to be moving forward towards what bring them together. So Arab nationalism is a progressive force.<BR/></I><BR/><BR/>Amre, you have absolutely no idea how many times my parents heard a similar argument about the Soviet Union - only in much greater, lecture-sized format.<BR/><BR/>It's not progress when you advance by forming a large group identity and starting to super-impose it on anyone nearby who doesn't fit into the mold.<BR/><BR/>Progress is when you make people realize that they don't need to hate and kill and maim each other over their differences - rather than trying to erase the differences altogether.<BR/><BR/><I>Since you are keen on being objective, What do you think about the possibilty of peaceful multi- religous and Multi-ethnic state solution?</I><BR/><BR/>A dead solution before it even started. "peaceful" isn't possible when the "multi-religious and multi-ethnic" involves groups that don't like each other to say the least. We'd end up like Lebanon, or Sudan, or Iraq. A civil war and genocide waiting to happen.<BR/><BR/>And then there is another simple fact - Jews want to have an independent sovereign state of their own because the alternatives end up pretty badly (I can't help but wonder if someone ever wrote a book titled History of the Jews: Massacres Throughout the Ages), and because controlling your own fate and developing your own culture is something most self-identifying groups want to have.<BR/><BR/><I>where Arabs and Jews live peacefully together in a secualr state? if the palestinains refugees are allowed to go back to their homes and live as equal citizens, Arabs will be left with no choice but to normailse and integrate the new state in the region?</I><BR/><BR/>And what happens when Arabs become a majority? Who will maintain the rights of the Jews then? I think that Arabs would only have no choice but to integrate the state into the region if it does not identify itself as Jewish in any way, shape, or form, but rather is just another Arab state - albeit one with a large Jewish population.<BR/><BR/>In this new state, a different nationalism would soon gain power - Arab nationalism, the nationalism of the majority. And where will the Jews be then, Amre? Second rate citizens, their culture and language and religion swept away from the state's daily discourse for not being "Arabic".<BR/><BR/><I>Kurds had no problem except when they carried arms against the state.</I><BR/><BR/>False. The Kurds did not enjoy the same rights as the Arabs of Iraq - they were essentially treated as a conquered region that had nothing to do with Iraq, with the exception of being harvested for resources. Arabic identity failed to interest them, and even after post-revolt agreements that promised them government representation and eventual autonomy, Iraq began colonization projects to relocate Arab citizens into Kurdish-majority regions.<BR/><BR/>Once Iraq became an full ally of the Soviet Union, it became emboldened enough to tear up the Kurdish autonomy agreements altogether and crush them, though the full scale of their misery would not come until later.<BR/><BR/>The Kurds suffered immensely during the Iraq-Iran war. When the war started, the logic was simple - Kurds are not Arabs, Kurds can't be trusted, so the Kurds have to be treated like traitors, rounded up, and killed.<BR/><BR/>Forced relocation, official and state-ordered Arab re-population of oil-rich regions by Arabs, and genocide - these were what the Kurds got from the government of Iraq. <BR/><BR/><I>Anyway I am serious. If we are to settle a quarrel both parties have to make concessions. Don't they?</I><BR/><BR/>To settle a quarrel, you have to realize that the other party in the quarrel is just as legitimate and worthy of respect as you are - demanding that Jews effectively give up their sovereignty and trust in the benevolence of their former enemies not only disregards the Jews as a group with their own wants and needs and core issues - no less important than those of Arabs - but is also utterly unreasonable in a purely logical sense of the word.<BR/><BR/>Amre, if you had come from a nation that suffered over 2000 years of being crushed under the boot of anyone who *had* a boot, often with the boot being quite expertly ground in, how would you feel at being offered to return to potential oppression as a solution to a current conflict?Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-73942257931515498742008-02-13T22:09:00.000+00:002008-02-13T22:09:00.000+00:00Anyway I am serious. If we are to settle a quarrel...<EM>Anyway I am serious. If we are to settle a quarrel both parties have to make concessions. Don't they?</EM><BR/><BR/>we have already made our concessions when we invited arafat to come here to take his part as a part of the two state solution ... sorry man ... but we are in our Khazar mood these days ... the two state solution is as much as we can be ready to discuss today if at all ...Nobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-19400683653050122692008-02-13T21:44:00.000+00:002008-02-13T21:44:00.000+00:00Iraq is not multi-ethnic. 85% ( according to U.S f...Iraq is not multi-ethnic. 85% ( according to U.S fact book ) are Arabs-shunnis and shiites alike. Kurds had no problem except when they carried arms against the state.<BR/><BR/>Anyway I am serious. If we are to settle a quarrel both parties have to make concessions. Don't they?<BR/><BR/><BR/>Look at you racist anti semitic remarks on Arabs, or maybe you don't consider the Arabs to be semites in the first place. Huh?<BR/><BR/>Definetly that sort of a condescending attidude is not one of someone keen on peace and co-existance.G.Garhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573287809747571814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-75570599481861838112008-02-13T21:33:00.000+00:002008-02-13T21:33:00.000+00:00Since you are keen on being objective, What do you...<EM>Since you are keen on being objective, What do you think about the possibilty of peaceful multi- religous and Multi-ethnic state solution? for the Arab-Israeli conflict? where Arabs and Jews live peacefully together in a secualr state? if the palestinains refugees are allowed to go back to their homes and live as equal citizens, Arabs will be left with no choice but to normailse and integrate the new state in the region?</EM><BR/><BR/>we would have gladly considered this option were it not for a small technical detail, namely an unfortunate loss of our hebrew continuity ... without it our natural partners in the region can be only the similarly discontinued persians ... we will have to satisfy ourselves with enviously watching from afar lebanon, iraq, darfur and other places where arabs implement their peaceful multi-ethnic and multi-religious state solutions ...Nobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-87531219922176728582008-02-13T20:04:00.000+00:002008-02-13T20:04:00.000+00:00Roman,And again, Amre, the region wasn't Arabic in...Roman,<BR/><BR/>And again, Amre, the region wasn't Arabic in nature. It had a myriad of cultures, kingdoms, religions, and languages. The Arabs of the Penisula (note the violent infighting tribes, supposedly an indication of being illeterate savages incapable of progress - by your logic) would take a long time to have any meaningful impact on the region.<BR/> <BR/> Pennisula Arabs were according to both mythology and history a mix of Bbaylonians, Aramaics, Yemenese and Egyptians. They were not alliens super-imposed on the Arab world.<BR/><BR/>Here you are presuming a static history of isolated elemnts. Ypou totally overlook the way cultures evolve and interact in dialectical proceses to forge new cultural identies. <BR/><BR/>Pennisula Arabs had one the richest and most noble value system man-kind has ever know. I suggest that you start reading pre-Islamic Arabic poetry and the jewels of the Arabic civilisation and sciense in Spain Baghdad Damascus and Cairo.<BR/><BR/> Don't forget that under the Arabic rule Jews expressd freedoms and tolerance never ever witnessed, maybe untill post world war two Europe.<BR/><BR/>Regarding Achaemenids, it remains a fact that they were illiterate with no aplhabet. They adopted the semitc babylonian ways.<BR/><BR/>they dint have an original civilisation nor a considerable impact to human civilisation.<BR/><BR/>The Parthians tribes who kicke the Greeks out Iran and the Saassanid nation-tribe never spoke one languyage. However their languages are of an indo-iranian origin, as opposed, to semitic.<BR/><BR/>If those groups who are now in addition to Turks( 25% of Iranian population) and the occupied Arabs on the westewrn shore of the Arabian gulf can forge an Iranian identity, why do you want to deny the Arabs who have richer, more ancient and more brilliant culure the right to forge their nation?<BR/><BR/>Isn't that that natural course of things?<BR/><BR/>people are supposed to be moving forward towards what bring them together. So Arab nationalism is a progressive force.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Well since you have shown an interest in objectivity and interest in studying the main ancestor of Arabic-Aramaic. Why don't you learn Arabic as well?<BR/><BR/>Since you are keen on being objective, What do you think about the possibilty of peaceful multi- religous and Multi-ethnic state solution? for the Arab-Israeli conflict? where Arabs and Jews live peacefully together in a secualr state? if the palestinains refugees are allowed to go back to their homes and live as equal citizens, Arabs will be left with no choice but to normailse and integrate the new state in the region?G.Garhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573287809747571814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-76072393859892575542008-02-13T18:56:00.000+00:002008-02-13T18:56:00.000+00:00it's without a doubt a very tempting proposition -...it's without a doubt a very tempting proposition - to theorize the poor persians out of existence ... however for the sake of objectivity i will have to agree with roman ....Nobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-15170330155919873222008-02-13T18:02:00.000+00:002008-02-13T18:02:00.000+00:00Amre,False. Read up on the rise of the Achaemenid ...Amre,<BR/><BR/>False. Read up on the rise of the Achaemenid Empire (your "illeterate tribes" were far more advanced than you give them credit - and when they went up against the Babylonian Empire they were already well developed) and further reading on Imperial Aramaic seems prudent, as is comparative unbiased reading regarding the local kingdoms of the era, their structure, and how having a faction vying for power here and there is daily routine (and stayed daily routine throughout the world in many countries to this day). Oh, and you've just about mixed up several periods of Persian history together, it would seem.<BR/><BR/>And again, Amre, the region wasn't Arabic in nature. It had a myriad of cultures, kingdoms, religions, and languages. The Arabs of the Penisula (note the violent infighting tribes, supposedly an indication of being illeterate savages incapable of progress - by your logic) would take a long time to have any meaningful impact on the region.<BR/><BR/>As for cultural divides - I speak, read and write both modern and old Hebrew, and read Aramaic. What does that make me, an eccentric? A novelty? A relic of the past that shouldn't be around anymore, as some kind academics once said? Our cultural differences are fewer than you might think. And I have been doing my best to be objective, I assure you.Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-69605482980684492592008-02-13T13:30:00.000+00:002008-02-13T13:30:00.000+00:00Persia had no imapct whatsoevr on the middle east....Persia had no imapct whatsoevr on the middle east.<BR/><BR/>It is an undeniable fact that Achaemenids were savage indo-Iranian people who sacked the semitc Babylon. They were illiterate savage tribes ( consensus) that is why they had to adopt the Iraqi semitic alphabet. Their contribution was never original. They merely mimced the original briliant semitic Iraqi culture.Later on after Arabs had liberated Iraq from their colonialism, they had some contribution to civilisation but only when they wrote in Arabic and lived within an Arabic cultral framwork.<BR/><BR/>Those are facts dude.<BR/><BR/>And Persians were never one people. Those were Baraberous Achaemenids, Parthians, Sassanids and Medians. There were bitter wars going on among each other . They never a spoke one language, however all their languages came from a common Indo-Iranian origin. Those are facts Roman.<BR/><BR/>One more thing, dspite of our irreconciable geopolitical and cultural differences, I have to admit that you have more wits, humour and common sense than Iranians. <BR/><BR/><BR/>Let's just forget that Iam an Arab and you are Israeli, and let pure objectivity dominate the argumentG.Garhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573287809747571814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-23182963970570748712008-02-13T08:34:00.000+00:002008-02-13T08:34:00.000+00:00RK and NB... and Nizo too... cm'on, you guys are b...RK and NB... and Nizo too... cm'on, you guys are busted. Amre clearly knows the secret:<BR/><BR/>There are no Hebrews and Jews are actually Khazarians.<BR/><BR/>The only indigenous population of the Middle East is Arabs. There were never any others.<BR/><BR/>The Hebrews, while clearly nonexistent and wholly and completely different from Jews (those are Khazars), oppressed everyone and were Romans in addition to being Hebrew. <BR/><BR/>Oh, and Persians are just weird Arabs. Or somesuch. <BR/><BR/>Yalla, RK and NB, pack your stuff, leave Yehuda and Israel to their original, eternal, glorious and ever-so-indigenous Arab owners. You Khazarians should be heading back to the Pontic-Caspian Steppe.<BR/><BR/>OK, that was the last one. Seriously.Abu Sa'arhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13759233794742423769noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-91038909096723786112008-02-13T05:43:00.000+00:002008-02-13T05:43:00.000+00:00Amre,Again, show me this caste system of yours. Wh...Amre,<BR/><BR/>Again, show me this caste system of yours. When or where did you hear of it, and reference it - including the actual day-to-day life under this system, and the period in question. Because when you speak crap about my history, you'd better have a couple of references to back it up.<BR/><BR/>Also, "Jews accepted some converts over the years" does not equal "Jews are not Hebrews", unless by your definition of a Hebrew one must practice some policy of extreme racial purity (or at the very least, not allow any outsider into the tribe-nation, like the Druze do). Also, I'm sorry to inform you that your modern-day Arab has about as much a connection to the actual Penisula Arabs (who I might add were already known by such a name, and as nomadic desert traders, in Jewish texts dating back a couple of milleniums) as the Ptolmean Empire had to Greeks.<BR/><BR/>You were conquered by Arabs, Amre, and you speak an Arabic language, practice an Arabic religion, and follow Arabic cultural trends today because of that conquest. But reverse-defining Arabs to rationalize the imperial expansion and pan-Arab nationalism as defined by Nasser is pretty lame on your side.<BR/><BR/>And the Persians existed, I assure you. The Persian empires had an enormous impact on the region, and were probably the most advanced imperial entity to over conquer the area. You slinging mud at them so far into the past only shows you in a bad light, and marks you not just as a history revisionist but also as an insecure one. Oh, and they did have to go far to have an impact on Egypt - all the way into what we call Sinai today. In that period, Egyptian vassals in the Levant were already far gone into the past, with Egypt proper having its major holdings much farther to the south, so it wasn't that easy for the Persians to find any Egyptians around. Why, maybe they conquered lands all the way here so they could find some of those mighty Egyptians. They certainly weren't impressed by the "Arvyiim" desert clans at the time, so maybe they just wanted to find themselves a better precursor of Arab might to grovel in front of.Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-43047456076002950372008-02-12T23:45:00.000+00:002008-02-12T23:45:00.000+00:00They were collectively known as Persians- much the...<EM>They were collectively known as Persians- much the same as Egyptians, Aramaics and Assyrians are collectively known as Arabs:))</EM><BR/><BR/>man .. you have to warn people in advance that you are writing your own history of the middle east because nowhere egyptians, aramaics and assyrians are collectively known as arabs ... otherwise people won't understand what you are talking aboutNobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-37736940395577211272008-02-12T23:37:00.000+00:002008-02-12T23:37:00.000+00:00Quoting "your mates" acknowledge clearly that Juda...<EM>Quoting "your mates" acknowledge clearly that Judaism is not restricted to Hebrews, would suffice:). It foils the foundations of the claim of Hebrew, as opposed to Jewish" continuity.</EM><BR/><BR/>amre ... you confuse yourself without a good reason ... judaism was not restricted to hebrews ... in the same way as it is not restricted to jews ... the same principle cannot "foil the foundations of the claim of Hebrew" continuity while at the same time upholding the claim of the jewish continuity !!!<BR/><BR/>the article that you falsely claimed taken offline gives a very good idea of what it means practically ... ashkenazi jews have a certain admixture of non jewish elements, yet all studies clearly show their overwhelmingly middle eastern origin and their relation to other jewish groups ... <BR/><BR/>the same goes about the ancient hebrews ... one simply cannot admit the jewish continuity but to deny the hebrew one ... <BR/><BR/>the khazar theory may contradict all facts and evidence but at least it has some internal logic .. but what you say now does not make any sense ... it's nonsenseNobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-56631040216202555432008-02-12T23:25:00.000+00:002008-02-12T23:25:00.000+00:00There is no such thing as Persians!!! the savage i...There is no such thing as Persians!!! the savage illiterate Achaemenids sacked Babaylon and adopted Iraqi writings and learnings. Later Parthians from the North liberated Iran from the Greek colonisation. In the end, came the Sassanides. Those were all groups who spoke different languages from an Indo-Iranian origin. They were collectively known as Persians- much the same as Egyptians, Aramaics and Assyrians are collectively known as Arabs:))<BR/><BR/><BR/>There is almost a consensus that Tohtmos the third of the 18 th dynasty crossed the Euphrates and reached Asia- Minor as well as parts of Mesoptamia. Besides, Egypt was so big and rich of a society back then. They didn't need to go so far:)<BR/><BR/>we're still waiting for you to explain to us just what racial caste system the Hebrews had, by the way) managed to beat back the Assyrians.<BR/><BR/> As for Egypt and Persians- Egyptians kicked the persians out in the 28th dynasty and liberated Egypt. However they came back only to be kicked out by the the Greek invasion of the middle east.<BR/><BR/>As regards the caste system, that was imposed on the local tribes in Palestine of Kannanite and Pilistine origin where some of them adopted Judaism. That is why they accepted christiuanity quite easily- much as Egyptians accepted it in defiance the Roman-Hebrew opressors.G.Garhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573287809747571814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-13868599828775501092008-02-12T23:18:00.000+00:002008-02-12T23:18:00.000+00:00Amre is right when he says that Arabs are an amalg...Amre is right when he says that Arabs are an amalgam of past civilizations in the region. So is the Arabic language a descendant of Proto-Semitic parents, with influences from other Semitic languages. Nevertheless, this doesn’t make the past civilizations Arab nor are sister languages like Aramaic or Hebrew equivalent to Arabic. <BR/><BR/>By the same logic, while Islam is built on Jewish and Christian foundations, this does not turn Abraham/Mary/Jesus/Moses into Muslims - or even Arabs. <BR/><BR/>Furthermore, I diagnose Amre with an Arab/Muslim affliction of reverse-appropriation, whereby history is reinvented and reinterpreted to fit into the mythical time frame of a “glorious Arab Past that goes back 10,000 years in time”. Source Amre’s profile. <BR/><BR/>It’s the same pattern that Hamas follows when they claim that a mythical city of Tal Al-Rabi existed prior to Tel Aviv. Instead of picking from hundreds of locales and villages that did truly exist, they chose to translate Tel Aviv into Arabic and claim that it was some long-lost mega-metropolis.Nizohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14906548939732203589noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-1662948188317580002008-02-12T23:03:00.000+00:002008-02-12T23:03:00.000+00:00Roman I am exhaused, so I want to finish off the ...Roman I am exhaused, so I want to finish off the argument as soon a possible. Quoting "your mates" acknowledge clearly that Judaism is not restricted to Hebrews, would suffice:). It foils the foundations of the claim of Hebrew, as opposed to Jewish" continuity.G.Garhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573287809747571814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-12288107761370267242008-02-12T23:00:00.000+00:002008-02-12T23:00:00.000+00:00Oh, and Amre... The Middle-East and northern Afric...Oh, and Amre... The Middle-East and northern Africa are about as Arab as Europe is Roman. Conquest, colonialism, and imperial policies that erase most local cultures, languages, and religions don't magically turn everyone into Arabs - no matter how similar the spoken languages of the region are (they're not dialects anymore, Amre. With dialects two people with different dialects can still understand each other, and this is no longer the case).<BR/><BR/>Like the Roman Empire, the dead Arab Empire will evolve into something greater if but given the chance. But just like with the Roman Empire, there's always someone who tries to dream up old myths...Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-3985814368363649562008-02-12T22:56:00.000+00:002008-02-12T22:56:00.000+00:00the actual words were:Reliable historical and gene...the actual words were:<BR/><EM><BR/>Reliable historical and genetic studies pin down the Ashkenasi Jews to the Khazar Turco-Tartaricc tribes who adopted Judaism in the 9th century in defiance to the Arabic conquests of central Asia by Quatayba Ibn Muslim. As for the rest, well, we could very well see that Flashas are Ethiopians.</EM>Nobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-44533818469040232662008-02-12T22:50:00.000+00:002008-02-12T22:50:00.000+00:00And Amre, you did indeed claim that all (or the va...And Amre, you did indeed claim that all (or the vast majority of) Ashkenazi Jews are of Khazari descent - I'm afraid that backpedalling on that one won't do the trick.Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-2757660667998113552008-02-12T22:33:00.000+00:002008-02-12T22:33:00.000+00:00Amre, it's late and I'm tired, but I'll say just t...Amre, it's late and I'm tired, but I'll say just this - your knowledge of Egyptian conquests and dominion is quite limited, in that while Egypt had some vassal-kings in the region of the Levant, these kings did not last long. The various small kingdoms may have paid tribute to Egypt at times (just as they did to other empires) but to call the overstreched and often limited Egyptian forces "dominion"... Pfeh to that.<BR/><BR/>As for Jesus, yes, he spoke Aramaic. So did most of the region's populace - and do you know why? It was the lingua franca of the Middle-East, the standardized spoken and written language of the Persian Empire. The language saw widespread use even in Egypt (yes, the Persians got all the way there, though not fully). Perhaps you wish to argue that Egyptians were rebelling against the Pharaoh by their use of the Imperial Persian language?<BR/><BR/>Incidentally, the Assyrians recorded both the conquest of Israel and the failed military campaign in Judah - funny how a bunch of tiny tribes ruling by tyranny and caste systems (we're still waiting for you to explain to us just what racial caste system the Hebrews had, by the way) managed to beat back the Assyrians.Roman Kalikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11360451459869355847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30984739.post-416604002898919282008-02-12T22:24:00.000+00:002008-02-12T22:24:00.000+00:00On a different note, Nobody.. please don't misquot...<EM><BR/>On a different note, Nobody.. please don't misquote me and contextualise my lines in a way that suits what you wish I had been saying, so as to discredit the whole issue. I never said that Hebrews are not related to jews.</EM><BR/><BR/>this is what you said man .. sorry ... go and read your first comment ...Nobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952955021226297401noreply@blogger.com